A discussion of Kitty Pryde

[@lantis]

Well it is mostly in the context of the X-men specifically.  Look at the ones who get the spotlight.  Scott, he's the leader and no one else can claim to occupy that part of his universe (until they decide to replace him of course).  Wolverine is Scott's opposite and until they decided that was the niche Logan was going to occupy he got minimal spotlight just like Kitty.  Beast is the premier example of the monster society sees when they think of mutants, so they've made him their go to example of "don't judge a book by it's cover."  Jean Grey was the prodigy of Xavier.  Emma was the reformed villain.  What would Kitty be?

Nightcrawler was able to carve out his niche by being the spiritual counter to Beast's philosophical and scientific nature.  So it doesn't have to be something no one else fills the role of, but she has to fill the role in a different way than someone else.

[Navarre]

It seems Kitty's role has generally been to be the character that represent "us". She was the gateway character for the reader to be the inexperienced teenager from the normal world who is now involved in the world of the mutants.

Despite all of her experiences, skills, and abilities I think she is still seen as that "normal" one. If so, perhaps because of that, they don't want to push her into anything else for fear of losing that accessibly.

But if all that is true I think they are doing the character a disservice. Her experiences have changed her and they need to let her evolve instead of forever being the teenager who isn't afraid to say that Professor Xavier is a jerk.

[Slappy]

She hasn't been "us" for at least 25 years.  Although a good question would be this.
If Kitty were to die, how long would it take to bring her back.  Weeks, months, years?  She was inside the bullet for how long?  She wasn't dead, but I think she was brought back more so people would know what happened to the bullet with the phantom girl inside rather than how is Kitty doing.

Bats was gone about a year, Superman less than that.  Cap wasn't gone long.  Even Hal Jordan returned as the Specter.  How long could Kitty be out?
(Now to buy Disney and see Kitty and Illyana gone forever)

[Navarre]

(Now to buy Disney and see Kitty and Illyana gone forever)

The sheer grief of the event might be the one thing that could bring down the Navarre Dominion.

I think Kitty still has some of the "us" quality written into her. I think she is still seen that way even though there is no reason she should be so limited.

They could probably get by with Kitty being gone for a long time but that's only because of the elements we are discussing. But perhaps if she had this niche @lantis is referring to then her absence would have more of an impact.

[MaximusRift]

Now tell me why this character doesn't have her own title or at least a bigger share of the spotlight?

Gladly; 

1) She doesn't have big boobs.
2) No claws.
3) No guns.
4) She's fairly mentally stable.
5) Her attacks don't draw blood or cause dismemberment.
6) No desire for vengeance.
7) She doesn't kill people.
No weapons whatsoever.
9) She has a positive outlook on life.
10) She doesn't look overtly sexual.

Good enough. :p

[Navarre]

You're right, Maximus. Her character is totally wrong to sell copies off the stands.

Don't forget that she doesn't adventure in a stylized bathing suit and stiletto heels too.

[Armaan]

That's her niche!!
She's the normal one!
She's not the dark crazy one, or the any crazy one. Not a tortured soul, just a woman with regular pains of crazy ordeals. In spite of all that's happened to her, she stays normal. She's the Ben Grimm of the xmen - the rock.
Which is why she works SO well as a supporting character, but can't see her as a main one.

[Slappy]

I saw we kill her.

[Navarre]

Ah, Slappy. You know killing her will solve nothing. She'll be back next year. Didn't you see the upcoming mega-event crossover "that will change everything"?

Armaan is right that Kitty stays in place because she's normal. Despite all those skills I continue to assert that she is designed to be the character the average person relates to and facilitates the connection to the rest of the team.

But that sort of thing inhibits her character growth. People do change over time and she isn't being given that opportunity.

There is nothing stopping the writers from bringing in a new character to fill Kitty's original role and writing a story that pushes Kitty forward in some direction. I think she seems the "safe" character to write and the writers are being lazy with her.

[The Mighty King Cobra]

Now tell me why this character doesn't have her own title or at least a bigger share of the spotlight?

Gladly; 

1) She doesn't have big boobs.
2) No claws.
3) No guns.
4) She's fairly mentally stable.
5) Her attacks don't draw blood or cause dismemberment.
6) No desire for vengeance.
7) She doesn't kill people.
No weapons whatsoever.
9) She has a positive outlook on life.
10) She doesn't look overtly sexual.

Good enough. :p

That's some pretty cynical stuff, there.  All of that, while true, is not the reason why she doesn't have her own title.  She is an ensemble player by her very nature, and all of her skills and her personality were designed to serve as a member of a team, generally in the "smart kid" or "plucky girlfriend" support role.  She has a lot of barnacles stuck to her in terms of story (and many of those barnacles involve or are comprised of the very skills that are being used here as her defense.)

Kitty as a solo character would need to be LESS definied and resourceful, not more so, lest we fall into the trap of "How the hell do we keep an intangible genius ninja occupied for 22 pages every month?"

Even setting aside how hard it is to launch a new book, how hard it is to launch a female character in today's market, and how unlikely it is that she'd ever break six issues, Kitty Pryde as a main character would no longer be the Kitty Pryde you're talking about.

[Navarre]

I'm not suggesting she have her own title. I don't think many characters can sustain solo titles except for the legendary ones. More seem to fail than succeed.

My "breaking away from the team" thing is a suggestion that there should be a story within the main title that focuses heavily on Kitty but places her in a situation where she is not on good terms with the team. It would give her a chance to still interact with the characters but the focus would be on her and her personal journey for a while instead of only how she contributes to the team.

[Beta Ray Bill Cosby]

I'm not suggesting she have her own title. I don't think many characters can sustain solo titles except for the legendary ones. More seem to fail than succeed.

My "breaking away from the team" thing is a suggestion that there should be a story within the main title that focuses heavily on Kitty but places her in a situation where she is not on good terms with the team. It would give her a chance to still interact with the characters but the focus would be on her and her personal journey for a while instead of only how she contributes to the team.

What like a back-up feature in an X-men book? Because although there's some room for solo character development in a team book you can start to run into the Animaniacs problem, having to sit through 15 minutes of Goodfeathers just to see Pinky and the Brain

[Gaumer]

I didn't mind Goodfeathers   But can I say, Best Analogy EVAR!!!


A solo mini can be a team book and still revolve around the character.

Wolverine makes it to the cover of so many mini's "starring" a certain character

[Navarre]

Possibly a backup feature or a mini. A mini would maybe work better.

But the repercussions of it would have to tie into the main title otherwise it would all be meaningless. It might be hard to coordinate that if she's still with the team at the time.

I was thinking of it more like, say, John Byrne's run on West Coast Avengers with the Scarlet Witch. Wanda was the focus and we went through all that surrounded her but it happened in the team book and we saw plenty of everyone else during that particular arc.

But the end result was something that dramatically changed Wanda's character forever. It was significant and turned Wanda from the supporting character who loves the Vision into a full-fledged standout character even in the team book.

I'm thinking along those lines here.

[The Mighty King Cobra]

I was thinking of it more like, say, John Byrne's run on West Coast Avengers with the Scarlet Witch. Wanda was the focus and we went through all that surrounded her but it happened in the team book and we saw plenty of everyone else during that particular arc.

As someone who enjoyed Wanda in the Vision & The Scarlet Witch minis and earlier issues of WCA, that development could also be seen as a huge character derailment...  In fact, she never quite recovered from that arc, and it was key to the eventual Bendis revelation of her as a giant deus ex machina crossover machine.